Tribulation

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Rev. Blume:
> TRIBULATION

Me:
Ahh, MEAT!!!!

 Rev. Blume:
> Timothy,
> 
> Let us say, for example, that your idea of a future
tribulation
> period is correct.  According to that thought (we are
chatting about the whole intro since we are chatting about
Chapter 1 so far, right?) the whole book of Revelation
deals with a period known as the "Great Tribulation."  That
is why you say the church is not here after such and such a
chapter.  You feel that is when "the" Great Tribulation
occurs.

Me:
I only use the phrase "Great Tribulation" since it carries
the general conotation, among pre-tribbers anyway, of a
period at the end of the age of the Gentiles in which the
church has been raptured and the 144,000 are "earmarked"
for salvation while God pours out His wrath upon the
unbelievers.  It is a misnomer however.

The last occurance of the word "tribulation" is in Rev.
7:14: "...These are they which came out of great
tribulation," (won't do the number thing, but it is COOL!).
The reference to the term tribulation is in the past tense.
The last reference to the "tribulation" of the Godly in
other than a past tense is in ch 6:11 where those under
the altar are told to "hang on a little while" until their
brothers (martyrs) would join them.  This is a clear
statement that those who killed the saints would not be
judged "until after" every last martyr was killed.  Here
judgment doesn't mean sentenced but the execution of the
sentence.

In ch. 7 we have a "sea" of people from "all nations" in
front of the throne.  These are identified as those who
have come out of "great tribulation" and what we see AFTER
this scene is the outpouring of God's WRATH upon those on
the Earth who would not believe on Jesus' name.

The word "wrath" occcurs 13 more times in the book of the
Revelation and ALWAYS refers to men on the Earth.  God does
not pour out His wrath on His faithful children, He may
correct them, but doesn't pour His wrath on them.  Now, who
is it that He is taking vengance upon?

Revelation 6, "9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I
saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for
the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: 10
And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord,
holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on
them that dwell on the earth? 11 And white robes were given
unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that
they should rest yet for a little season, until their
fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be
killed as they were, should be fulfilled."  Here the
martyrs are told to "wait" until their "brothers" would be
killed just like they were and THEN God would pour out His
wrath on those "THAT DWELL ON THE EARTH."  Now, in verse
17, we find that "the great day of his wrath is come;" 
What happen in the mean time then?  The only possible
conclusion is that the last martyr was killed.  Now
consider that just because the last martyr is killed
doesn't mean that the last Christian is dead.  The reason
that we must conclude that the Christians are gone by the
time of the outpouring of God's wrath is found in verses 15
and 16: "15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men,
and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty
men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves
in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; 16 And said
to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from
the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the
wrath of the Lamb:"  Some where between verse 11 and verse
16 we not only lose the martyrs but all Christians since it
says in verse 15 that EVERYONE on Earth is trying to HIDE
from the WRATH of God.  

This would be those left after the rapture.  Am I pre-trib?
 No, I am pre-wrath.  Looking for consistency of Scripture?
 Read about Noah.  I haven't space here for the
correlations but they become obvious in a hurry.

In Rev. 9:18 we see that 1/3 of the worlds population is
killed by three plagues.  Now we get to the part that tells
us just who the rest of the people on the Earth are.  In
verses 20 and 21 we read how "the rest of the men that were
not killed by these plagues" wouldn't repent of their sins
against God.  So we have 1/3 killed and 2/3's that will not
repent of their sins.  That is 3/3's as far as I can tell
and means just that with the exclusion of the 144,000 which
are
tagged to be a remnant.  Now is a good time to consider the
condition of those that would be left behind in the
rapture.

In 2 Thes. Paul tells them not to be fooled, that the "day
of Christ" had not come.  This day is commonly known to be
the judgment day of the evil doers of the Earth.  Paul says
not to worry since this day "COULDN'T COME UNTIL" the MAN
of sin was revealed.
If this is after the working of Rev. Blumes model, He
should have ALREADY been revealed.  Paul says that it is
the "Church" that is holding him back by the Holy Ghost.

2 Thessalonians 2
6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be
revealed in his time. 

Jesus IN the Church.

7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he
who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.


This accounts for Rev. Blumes point; "mystery of iniquity
doth already work" but Paul says that "someone" (Christ in
His "Body")
"reins" iniquity in until He is taken (snatched/raptured)
out of the way.  This cannot be any wickedness in the
Church (individual or collective) since the Holy Ghost
would have to be "taken out of the way."

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord
shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall
destroy with the brightness of his coming: 

In Rev. Blume's scenerio this took place on the day of
Pentecost.
If however this is a MAN in the near future Jesus can
"destroy" him without making a final disposition of Satan.

9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with
all power and signs and lying wonders, 

Here you have it!  "Him" (one being) whose "coming" (not
there yet) is after (in the manner of) Satan (another
being).  This was written AFTER the fall of the Temple my
friends.  Call him what you like but I think that
"Antichrist" is pretty accurate.

10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them
that perish; because they received not the love of the
truth, that they might be saved. 

11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion,
that they should believe a lie: 

Strong delusion (energetically effective) that the
UNBELIVERS would ALL believe a lie.  Could this lie be that
impostor's claim to be Messiah?  Yeah.

12 That they all might be damned who believed not the
truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

That they ALL might be damned who "believed" not the truth.
 Past tense.  

This is what I mean by a pre-trib rapture.

Timothy Litteral
472 Grant St.
Marion Ohio 43302
trlitteral@usa.net
http://members.tripod.com/~trlitteral